Hi,
Does anyone have experience with Ignitech TCIP4 as a replacement for Bosch inducers.
My main consideration is that the timing advance is done by the rotor with two steps ( step one below 1700 RPM and step two over 1700 RPM) at the Bosch system.
At Igitech the timing advance is done in as a part of the system.
will there be interferens between the rotor timing advance and the electronic advance system at Ignitech, or is it necessary to weld up the rotor so there is only one step?
I will still use the Bosch pick ups.
Best regards Per
Ignitech as replacement for Bosch inducers
-
Per Garbos
- Diana
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 11:41 am
- Location: Denmark
-
Per Garbos
- Diana
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 11:41 am
- Location: Denmark
HI Martin
I have seen it at Kaemna in germany but the producer is: www.ignitech.cz
and they are located in Czech Republic.
I wrote about a person who put the system on a bevel, but i have never heard about the final result.
www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=34482
I still think it could be interesting to know more about this system -related tol bevels.
Best regards Per
I have seen it at Kaemna in germany but the producer is: www.ignitech.cz
and they are located in Czech Republic.
I wrote about a person who put the system on a bevel, but i have never heard about the final result.
www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=34482
I still think it could be interesting to know more about this system -related tol bevels.
Best regards Per
Hi
I run one of the ignitech units on my NC30 and have been happy with the results, have had no experience with them on Bevel drives though.
Pretty sure the ignition advance steps in the Bosch system are done by the transducers, not by the rotor/pickups so shouldn't be any problem for you.
regards
jon
I run one of the ignitech units on my NC30 and have been happy with the results, have had no experience with them on Bevel drives though.
Pretty sure the ignition advance steps in the Bosch system are done by the transducers, not by the rotor/pickups so shouldn't be any problem for you.
regards
jon
1983 900 S2
1983 Mk III Le Mans
1992 Honda VFR400r
1976 CB550f
1983 Mk III Le Mans
1992 Honda VFR400r
1976 CB550f
-
Per Garbos
- Diana
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 11:41 am
- Location: Denmark
hi Jon,
I am 100% sure that the timing advancing is done by the step at the rotor.
There are two steps on the rotor- one for lower timing and one for higher timing. The lowest step is for the higher advancing.
The lower step takes over when the RPM excees approx. 1700 RPM.
My Bevel is a S2 with this bosch system.
Best regards Per
I am 100% sure that the timing advancing is done by the step at the rotor.
There are two steps on the rotor- one for lower timing and one for higher timing. The lowest step is for the higher advancing.
The lower step takes over when the RPM excees approx. 1700 RPM.
My Bevel is a S2 with this bosch system.
Best regards Per
-
MartinMille BANNED
- BANNED
- Posts: 766
- Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 8:15 pm
Hi JonPer Garbos wrote:hi Jon,
I am 100% sure that the timing advancing is done by the step at the rotor.
There are two steps on the rotor- one for lower timing and one for higher timing. The lowest step is for the higher advancing.
The lower step takes over when the RPM excees approx. 1700 RPM.
My Bevel is a S2 with this bosch system.
Best regards Per
The advance curve is done inside the ign box and is self adjusting in the bosch engines according to the timing mark/point for that cylinder , pre<bosch is either full advance or off , I think I got that right LOL
Marty
Ignitech ignition
I have used an Ignitech unit on my single, so I know something about them, but rather less about the Bosch system!
The Ignitech is a digital unit, available in capacitor discharge (CDI) or inductive versions
They work with an inductive pick up and a rotor, either on the crank or a half time shaft like a single or roundcase points shaft.
A single tooth on the rotor give the unit two pieces of information: the time that the rising edge passes the pick up and the time that the falling edge passes. When you start and at low rpm the unit will fire a spark at the trailing edge on the rotor. Above 1700 rpm it can calculate the rpm well enough and can now use it's map to work out when to fire the ignition to give you the advance you have programmed. Essentially it sees the rising edge, then starts counting until it thinks its at the right point and fires. After it fires it works out when it need to start current flowing through the coil for it to be saturated in time for the next spark - or it charges the capacitor if its a CDI
There are a couple of main errors:
1. as you spin the rotor faster, the pulse produced by the pickup gets bigger, so the trigger position will get a little earlier. The effect depends on the diameter of the rotor, the height of the tooth and the sharpness of the tooth edges. Nice sharp edges and it's probably irrelevant
2. the unit takes a finite time to do it's stuff, so there is a delay between when it thinks it should spark and when it actually does. I can't find the write up of the guy in Victoria who measured this, but he reckoned it was about 1 degree per 1k rpm over about 4k
Answer to both of these is to use a dyno to get the curve right
On my single I have also used a CDI unit from http://www.hpi.be/ and in an email discussion with an engineer there they claim that the above two effects have been compensated for in their ignitions. But they are more expensive and they charge a lot extra for the software to program them
Hope that helps
The Ignitech is a digital unit, available in capacitor discharge (CDI) or inductive versions
They work with an inductive pick up and a rotor, either on the crank or a half time shaft like a single or roundcase points shaft.
A single tooth on the rotor give the unit two pieces of information: the time that the rising edge passes the pick up and the time that the falling edge passes. When you start and at low rpm the unit will fire a spark at the trailing edge on the rotor. Above 1700 rpm it can calculate the rpm well enough and can now use it's map to work out when to fire the ignition to give you the advance you have programmed. Essentially it sees the rising edge, then starts counting until it thinks its at the right point and fires. After it fires it works out when it need to start current flowing through the coil for it to be saturated in time for the next spark - or it charges the capacitor if its a CDI
There are a couple of main errors:
1. as you spin the rotor faster, the pulse produced by the pickup gets bigger, so the trigger position will get a little earlier. The effect depends on the diameter of the rotor, the height of the tooth and the sharpness of the tooth edges. Nice sharp edges and it's probably irrelevant
2. the unit takes a finite time to do it's stuff, so there is a delay between when it thinks it should spark and when it actually does. I can't find the write up of the guy in Victoria who measured this, but he reckoned it was about 1 degree per 1k rpm over about 4k
Answer to both of these is to use a dyno to get the curve right
On my single I have also used a CDI unit from http://www.hpi.be/ and in an email discussion with an engineer there they claim that the above two effects have been compensated for in their ignitions. But they are more expensive and they charge a lot extra for the software to program them
Hope that helps
Regards,
James
James